Comments on: An Unmarketable Time Period? http://www.romancingtheblog.com/blog/2006/11/07/an-unmarketable-time-period/ What's hip, what's now, what's tomorrow in the romance genre world. Sat, 09 Jan 2010 20:26:04 -0600 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.8.4 hourly 1 By: Candice Gilmer http://www.romancingtheblog.com/blog/2006/11/07/an-unmarketable-time-period/comment-page-1/#comment-13129 Candice Gilmer Wed, 08 Nov 2006 19:01:29 +0000 http://www.romancingtheblog.com/blog/2006/11/07/an-unmarketable-time-period/#comment-13129 :twisted: :mrgreen: :shock: (smiley faces were applied by my overzealous four-year-old) I think the point is amazing Kristin. I just started a new scifi romance, and as I work through the general beginning and start figuring out my details, I caught myself a few times thinking "what's the difference between this story and something from a western?" Which has made me look deeper into the characters and the story to find a way to keep it "scifi" and not something someone will read and say "it's a western in space," yet holding to the overall theme, which is about the strength of family, and how that endures no matter what, and how we do whatever we can for a family. So this one hit home with me today in a very profound way. Thanks for the post! :twisted: :mrgreen: :shock:
(smiley faces were applied by my overzealous four-year-old)

I think the point is amazing Kristin. I just started a new scifi romance, and as I work through the general beginning and start figuring out my details, I caught myself a few times thinking “what’s the difference between this story and something from a western?” Which has made me look deeper into the characters and the story to find a way to keep it “scifi” and not something someone will read and say “it’s a western in space,” yet holding to the overall theme, which is about the strength of family, and how that endures no matter what, and how we do whatever we can for a family.

So this one hit home with me today in a very profound way.

Thanks for the post!

]]> By: Kalen Hughes http://www.romancingtheblog.com/blog/2006/11/07/an-unmarketable-time-period/comment-page-1/#comment-13123 Kalen Hughes Wed, 08 Nov 2006 16:17:31 +0000 http://www.romancingtheblog.com/blog/2006/11/07/an-unmarketable-time-period/#comment-13123 <i>There’s nothing “special” about the historical romance anymore because everything has become so locked into the settings and social circles(mainly aristocratic, mainly London, and mainly Regency).</i> I'm not sure I agree with this. Some writers overcome the "much of a muchness" and do it so splendidly I'm left frothing with jealously (if that's possible, LOL!). Take Julia Ross for example. Her books don’t have a setting which is original, but her command of the language, her voice, totally transport me. Pam Rosenthal, too. Her deeply political plots are amazing. And then there’s Jo Beverley, whose books pretty much set the bar, IMO. I find all of these writers plenty "special". There’s nothing “special” about the historical romance anymore because everything has become so locked into the settings and social circles(mainly aristocratic, mainly London, and mainly Regency).

I’m not sure I agree with this. Some writers overcome the “much of a muchness” and do it so splendidly I’m left frothing with jealously (if that’s possible, LOL!). Take Julia Ross for example. Her books don’t have a setting which is original, but her command of the language, her voice, totally transport me. Pam Rosenthal, too. Her deeply political plots are amazing. And then there’s Jo Beverley, whose books pretty much set the bar, IMO.

I find all of these writers plenty “special”.

]]> By: Camilla http://www.romancingtheblog.com/blog/2006/11/07/an-unmarketable-time-period/comment-page-1/#comment-13119 Camilla Wed, 08 Nov 2006 05:57:13 +0000 http://www.romancingtheblog.com/blog/2006/11/07/an-unmarketable-time-period/#comment-13119 Kalen said: <i>Or that when you get outside of the familiar historical settings the author doesn’t really know how their characters would have behaved, lived, etc. so we end up with very modern feeling protagonists running around 16th century Venice, or 15th century Turkey, etc. At least this has been my experience when I branch out as a reader.</i> That has been my experience as well, which is bad because when the books not set in settings/time periods most readers are unfamiliar with(at least books published in the late-late-90s and 2000s) flop, the time period is blamed and not the execution of the book. Jane said: <i>To ignore the importance of the setting is greatly to blame, imo, for the demise of the historical. Too much emphasis was placed on themes and not enough on the congruence between theme and setting, hence the wallpaper historical moniker.</i> Agreed! All timeless themes and plots will unfold differently depending on the time period <b>and</b> the social setting of the characters (a barrister and governess would have a completely different conflict than a Duke and a governess). IMO, I think the love for the paranormal romance is in part because of the world-building created by the majority of paranormal romance/urban fantasy authors. Each series/book is unique to the author, so readers gobble them all up because they know no author will tell the same story even though twenty authors may be writing about vampires. There's nothing "special" about the historical romance anymore because everything has become so locked into the settings and social circles(mainly aristocratic, mainly London, and mainly Regency). Kalen said: Or that when you get outside of the familiar historical settings the author doesn’t really know how their characters would have behaved, lived, etc. so we end up with very modern feeling protagonists running around 16th century Venice, or 15th century Turkey, etc.

At least this has been my experience when I branch out as a reader.

That has been my experience as well, which is bad because when the books not set in settings/time periods most readers are unfamiliar with(at least books published in the late-late-90s and 2000s) flop, the time period is blamed and not the execution of the book.

Jane said: To ignore the importance of the setting is greatly to blame, imo, for the demise of the historical. Too much emphasis was placed on themes and not enough on the congruence between theme and setting, hence the wallpaper historical moniker.

Agreed! All timeless themes and plots will unfold differently depending on the time period and the social setting of the characters (a barrister and governess would have a completely different conflict than a Duke and a governess). IMO, I think the love for the paranormal romance is in part because of the world-building created by the majority of paranormal romance/urban fantasy authors. Each series/book is unique to the author, so readers gobble them all up because they know no author will tell the same story even though twenty authors may be writing about vampires. There’s nothing “special” about the historical romance anymore because everything has become so locked into the settings and social circles(mainly aristocratic, mainly London, and mainly Regency).

]]> By: Isabella Snow http://www.romancingtheblog.com/blog/2006/11/07/an-unmarketable-time-period/comment-page-1/#comment-13118 Isabella Snow Wed, 08 Nov 2006 05:48:03 +0000 http://www.romancingtheblog.com/blog/2006/11/07/an-unmarketable-time-period/#comment-13118 I love historicals, but would never have the patience to research for one. Mucho respect to y'all who write them. I could never do it. But I'll read them any day of the week. :smile: I love historicals, but would never have the patience to research for one. Mucho respect to y’all who write them. I could never do it. But I’ll read them any day of the week. :smile:

]]> By: Jane http://www.romancingtheblog.com/blog/2006/11/07/an-unmarketable-time-period/comment-page-1/#comment-13117 Jane Wed, 08 Nov 2006 05:15:42 +0000 http://www.romancingtheblog.com/blog/2006/11/07/an-unmarketable-time-period/#comment-13117 I have to agree with the other readers here and that is simply because the theme or story arc is timeless doesn't mean the framework surrounding it also interchangeable. One of the things I like so well about Prince of Ice by Emma Holly was the societal struggle which gave rise to the conflict between the hero and heroine. Societal differences are a common theme in romances. You see it in the Duke/Governness romances or in the Boss/Secretary romances. However, how that conflict plays out depends greatly upon the societal machinations that dictate action and reaction. To ignore the importance of the setting is greatly to blame, imo, for the demise of the historical. Too much emphasis was placed on themes and not enough on the congruence between theme and setting, hence the wallpaper historical moniker. World building, even in non paranormal/fantasy romances, is just as important because it creates the escape for which readers are looking. If the setting is not rich, if the characters are not acting within the framework of society, then the book lacks realism. To me, this is the worst thing about trend chasing. Too many authors get caught up with writing what's hot instead of what they truly love leading to bland and unoriginal historicals, paranormals, or just regular fiction. I have to agree with the other readers here and that is simply because the theme or story arc is timeless doesn’t mean the framework surrounding it also interchangeable. One of the things I like so well about Prince of Ice by Emma Holly was the societal struggle which gave rise to the conflict between the hero and heroine. Societal differences are a common theme in romances. You see it in the Duke/Governness romances or in the Boss/Secretary romances. However, how that conflict plays out depends greatly upon the societal machinations that dictate action and reaction. To ignore the importance of the setting is greatly to blame, imo, for the demise of the historical. Too much emphasis was placed on themes and not enough on the congruence between theme and setting, hence the wallpaper historical moniker.

World building, even in non paranormal/fantasy romances, is just as important because it creates the escape for which readers are looking. If the setting is not rich, if the characters are not acting within the framework of society, then the book lacks realism.

To me, this is the worst thing about trend chasing. Too many authors get caught up with writing what’s hot instead of what they truly love leading to bland and unoriginal historicals, paranormals, or just regular fiction.

]]> By: Kalen Hughes http://www.romancingtheblog.com/blog/2006/11/07/an-unmarketable-time-period/comment-page-1/#comment-13115 Kalen Hughes Tue, 07 Nov 2006 22:20:03 +0000 http://www.romancingtheblog.com/blog/2006/11/07/an-unmarketable-time-period/#comment-13115 <i>It also seems to me that the reason so many other settings don’t work is that authors try such radically different stories than those tried and true timeless themes that readers are even more unsettled.</i> Or that when you get outside of the familiar historical settings the author doesn’t really know how their characters would have behaved, lived, etc. so we end up with very modern feeling protagonists running around 16th century Venice, or 15th century Turkey, etc. At least this has been my experience when I branch out as a reader. It also seems to me that the reason so many other settings don’t work is that authors try such radically different stories than those tried and true timeless themes that readers are even more unsettled.

Or that when you get outside of the familiar historical settings the author doesn’t really know how their characters would have behaved, lived, etc. so we end up with very modern feeling protagonists running around 16th century Venice, or 15th century Turkey, etc.

At least this has been my experience when I branch out as a reader.

]]> By: Alice Audrey http://www.romancingtheblog.com/blog/2006/11/07/an-unmarketable-time-period/comment-page-1/#comment-13114 Alice Audrey Tue, 07 Nov 2006 21:20:39 +0000 http://www.romancingtheblog.com/blog/2006/11/07/an-unmarketable-time-period/#comment-13114 Sounds to me like you are talking about archetypes. Alice Sounds to me like you are talking about archetypes.

Alice

]]> By: Bev (BB) http://www.romancingtheblog.com/blog/2006/11/07/an-unmarketable-time-period/comment-page-1/#comment-13111 Bev (BB) Tue, 07 Nov 2006 19:22:18 +0000 http://www.romancingtheblog.com/blog/2006/11/07/an-unmarketable-time-period/#comment-13111 <i>This “bigger” story (accepting death and living life fully) could be explored in any era really. And it’s that timelessness that readers embrace and react to. And if you can, why write a romance in the Pleistocene era (and yes, I’m being facetious) when you could choose a more marketable period for your timeless story—a time period more likely to get an editor on board and excited?</i> Hmmm, seems to me that exactly the reverse should be true. If the story truly is timeless, then shouldn't that be the one to work well in just about any setting so why not try one that's new and fresh rather than already done to death? It also seems to me that the reason so many other settings don't work is that authors try such radically different stories than those tried and true timeless themes that readers are even more unsettled. Why not use those timeless themes to make the new and different a little bit more palatable rather than creating more of the same? This “bigger” story (accepting death and living life fully) could be explored in any era really. And it’s that timelessness that readers embrace and react to. And if you can, why write a romance in the Pleistocene era (and yes, I’m being facetious) when you could choose a more marketable period for your timeless story—a time period more likely to get an editor on board and excited?

Hmmm, seems to me that exactly the reverse should be true. If the story truly is timeless, then shouldn’t that be the one to work well in just about any setting so why not try one that’s new and fresh rather than already done to death?

It also seems to me that the reason so many other settings don’t work is that authors try such radically different stories than those tried and true timeless themes that readers are even more unsettled. Why not use those timeless themes to make the new and different a little bit more palatable rather than creating more of the same?

]]> By: Camilla http://www.romancingtheblog.com/blog/2006/11/07/an-unmarketable-time-period/comment-page-1/#comment-13110 Camilla Tue, 07 Nov 2006 18:04:36 +0000 http://www.romancingtheblog.com/blog/2006/11/07/an-unmarketable-time-period/#comment-13110 IMO, the theme may have the ability to transcend different time periods, but the way the characters react to them will be completely different depending on the era. If I want to read an mid Victorian set novel, I don't want social mores of the early Victorian era creeping into the book, just as when I pick up a Restoration era romance I don't want it to read as though it could just as easily have been a Regency set historical. Otherwise, that's how we end up with the homogenizing of the historical(eg the lumping of the 19th century as one long time period. :eek:). It's hard because the big publishers tend to hover around "Regency" and "Victorian" set historicals, but as Michelle Styles has said, there are a few publishers out there who like different settings. And I heartily nod in agreement with the statement that everyone will be able to tell if you're not really into the time period your book is set in. IMO, the theme may have the ability to transcend different time periods, but the way the characters react to them will be completely different depending on the era. If I want to read an mid Victorian set novel, I don’t want social mores of the early Victorian era creeping into the book, just as when I pick up a Restoration era romance I don’t want it to read as though it could just as easily have been a Regency set historical. Otherwise, that’s how we end up with the homogenizing of the historical(eg the lumping of the 19th century as one long time period. :eek: ). It’s hard because the big publishers tend to hover around “Regency” and “Victorian” set historicals, but as Michelle Styles has said, there are a few publishers out there who like different settings. And I heartily nod in agreement with the statement that everyone will be able to tell if you’re not really into the time period your book is set in.

]]> By: Kalen Hughes http://www.romancingtheblog.com/blog/2006/11/07/an-unmarketable-time-period/comment-page-1/#comment-13109 Kalen Hughes Tue, 07 Nov 2006 17:33:07 +0000 http://www.romancingtheblog.com/blog/2006/11/07/an-unmarketable-time-period/#comment-13109 I'm a great believer in writing what you love. I think it shows. Michelle’s got this one right, IMO. She writes what she loves. I'm a big Roman history buff and can't wait to read her books! Me, I love all things Georgian. Lot's of folks say they don't like men in lace and powder. *SHRUG* I love the idea of steel incased in silk. I think it’s sexy as hell. I love watching films set in the era: <i>Tom Jones</i> (Albert Finney or 1997 version), <i>Aristocrats</i>, <i>Dangerous Liaisons</i>, <i>Ridicule</i>, <i>The Madness of King George</i>, <i>The Affair of the Necklace</i>, <i>The Lady and the Duke</i>, <i>The Scarlet Pimpernel</i> (Richard E. Grant miniseries). I love the clothes. The politics. The intrigue. The scandals. I’m a great believer in writing what you love. I think it shows. Michelle’s got this one right, IMO. She writes what she loves. I’m a big Roman history buff and can’t wait to read her books!

Me, I love all things Georgian. Lot’s of folks say they don’t like men in lace and powder. *SHRUG* I love the idea of steel incased in silk. I think it’s sexy as hell. I love watching films set in the era: Tom Jones (Albert Finney or 1997 version), Aristocrats, Dangerous Liaisons, Ridicule, The Madness of King George, The Affair of the Necklace, The Lady and the Duke, The Scarlet Pimpernel (Richard E. Grant miniseries).

I love the clothes. The politics. The intrigue. The scandals.

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